February 19, 2017

*** This hand was suggested by glmccuskey
0*-0  ?
28%
24%
20%
15%
10%
Total votes: 185
BigFoot Bob
624 votes

Joined: April 2016

 
 
 
Sunday 3:04 AM
Worth tossing the fives to the crib because I can still hit a good hand.
Rosemarie44
2051 votes

Joined: March 2016

 
 
 
Sunday 3:08 AM
Toss 5-K (suited) and hold run. Hand is slightly higher than toss 5-5
(combined value 16.30; crib plus exp. avg. hand). Every cut increases value of hand from 8 points to a maximum of 14 points. Cut of a 10 card favors hand and crib.
dec
6327 votes

Joined: April 2008

 
 
 
Sunday 3:15 AM
A K-5 discard has not done lately much for me in any type of play, so nickel chucking I go! dec
Ras2829
5125 votes

Joined: November 2008

 
 
 
Sunday 4:45 AM
Twenty years ago I instructed folks to toss 5-5 from this hand. If you are one of those folks, accept my apologies. From this configuration the 7-8 is even the better toss. Hold the four-card run as every cut in the deck adds value and discard the 5-X. In this case we toss the suited 5-K. Matters not what the 5-X looks like. As dealer of hand one, will choose defense and play off the lead.
Inushtuk1 says: Hi Ras. I read your late comment yesterday about buying bananas only 2 at a time. Very funny. Mentioned it to my wife. She said she once new an old-timer who told her he doesn't even buy green bananas anymore. Thought you might get a kick out of that.
glmccuskey
4075 votes

Joined: April 2011

 
 
 
Sunday 5:45 AM
This is the way I played it in a life game. Wanted to see what you guys thought.
Ras2829 says: Thanks much glmccuskey - very instructional puzzle. Got my appointment to look at my cataracts since have had them for 20 years. That's on 2/28 and since I have been adjusting to them for a couple of decades, will not schedule the removal until returning from that great Reno crib tournament first weekend in March. Hopefully will stumble into many of those on this site during the few days there.
james500
3895 votes

Joined: June 2013

 
 
 
Sunday 6:04 AM
6-7-8-X (5-5) for me.
Hopefully the value of the crib will make up for the smaller hand score. Prior to the cut I have 5, whereas I could've kept 8 with the double run, or 6 with 5-6-7-8.
Jazzselke
2569 votes

Joined: March 2009

 
 
 
Sunday 6:15 AM
One instance of splitting the fives. Of course I was indoctrinated by Ras on this hand when I started
Guest says: and now I am...I sent the 5's. S;)
Guest says: and now I am...I sent the 5's. S;)
Guest says: and now I am...I sent the 5's. S;)
Guest says: and now I am...I sent the 5's. S;)
Guest says: ugh...very much so!
Guest says: tommy six times.......
Gougie00
5702 votes

Joined: March 2008

 
 
 
Sunday 6:27 AM
I wasnt sure if 78 wasnt the best answer. I tossed suited 5K. I can account for 13 pts, and need to peg a few holes.
ILostMyJob
3537 votes

Joined: September 2013

 
 
 
Sunday 7:20 AM
Toss K5 is also interesting...
The_Bee_Mann
306 votes

Joined: November 2016

 
 
 
Sunday 9:37 AM
I will keep my double run. Tossing the pair of 5s was tempting.
Coeurdelion
5574 votes

Joined: October 2007

 
 
 
Sunday 10:12 AM
Nice position to be in for first hand of a game. Do we throw 5-5, or 5S-K or 7-8?. I don't think we should keep 5-5-6-7 and give our box the poor 8-K but I'll include it:

6-7-8-K: 5pts + 8¾pts (Schell: 8.79) = 13¾pts

5C-6-7-8: 6pts + 6½pts (Schell: 6.66) = 12½pts

5-5-6-K: 6pts + 6½pts (Schell: 6.53) = 12½pts

5-5-6-7: 8pts + 3¼pts (Schell: 3.16) = 11¼pts

Potential:

6-7-8-K: Improves with AAAA, 2222, 55, 666, 777, 888, 9999, KKK = 26 cuts = 26/46 = 56.5% up to 10/12pts with 666, 777, 888 = 9 cuts.

5-6-7-8: Improves with AAAA, 2222, 3333, 4444, 55, 666, 777, 888, 9999 + 15xXs = 46 cuts = 46/46 = 100.0% up to 10/12/14pts with 2222, 55, 666, 777, 888 = 15 cuts.

5-5-6-K: Improves with 4444, 55, 666, 777, 9999 + 15xXs = 31 cuts = 31/46 = 67.4% up to 10/12/14/16pts with 4444, 55, 666, 777 + 15xXs = 27 cuts.

5-5-6-7: Improves with 2222, 3333, 4444, 55, 666, 777, 888, 9999 +15xX = 42 cuts = 42/46 = 91.3% up to 10/12/14/16/17pts with all cuts.

Pegging:

5-6-7-8 will perhaps peg the best but pegging Defense all the hands could prove troublesome.

Position:

As usual as First Dealer we'll be playing Defense with par-hole at 7pts but trying to achieve above the average of 16pts for Dealer's score.

Summary:

6-7-8-K has the best starting value but 5-6-7-8 has much better potential with all cuts for improvement and 15 cuts for 10-14pts. 5-5-6-7 has the highest maximum and a high number of cuts for improvement but has the lowest starting value so I do not think it will make this up. Therefore although the 5-5 is tempting I'll go for the suited 5-K and try to peg some points with 5-6-7-8 but as safely as I can.
HalscribCLX
5297 votes

Joined: February 2008

 
 
 
Sunday 10:41 AM
At 0*-0 playing a Defense strategy for the pegging the dynamic expected averages and Win/Loss %s are:

________________Pone's
Defense___Hand__Pegs___Crib_Total____W9 %____W10 %
5C-6-7-8__9.57+(-2.13)+6.50=13.94____49.3____59.6
5-5-6-K___9.35+(-2.11)+6.36=13.60____47.3____58.7
6-7-8-K___7.11+(-2.09)+8.56=13.58____46.6____57.4
5-5-6-7__12.22+(-1.96)+2.90=13.16____47.3____58.7

Defense_______L9 %____W10 %
5C-6-7-8______27.0____17.3
5-5-6-K_______26.1____17.8
6-7-8-K_______26.8____18.9
5-5-6-7_______26.1____17.8

5C-6-7-8 is 0.34pt better than 5-5-6-K and 0.36pt better than 6-7-8-K for expected averages. It is also appreciably better for Win %s, although 5-5-6-K and 6-7-8-K are slightly better for Loss %s. So I'll select 5S-K to discard.

After the 10 cut I'll play Defense to the lead.
Inushtuk1
1464 votes

Joined: July 2016

 
 
 
Sunday 11:00 AM
This is a replica of the hand mentioned on the last page of Schell's article, Discarding to your crib. Have to admit before I read the article I would have tossed 5-5. And even earlier in my playing days I would have kept the double run.

I thought what if the K was a 10? Would that make the (5-5) toss worthwhile? Ahhh, no! 6-7-8-10 is only 0.09 points more than 6-7-8-K for its average hand. So it looks like 5-6-7-8(5-X) is the better play no matter what the X-card is.
Inushtuk1 says: Another problem with the (5-5) toss is we have no Magic Eleven. Something that could come in very handy.
Ras2829 says: Hi Inusjhtuk1: Ah, yes, that six spot comes in so handy on a X-card lead. Close the count with that five spot for 31 when in defensive mode. Several times recently my opponent had pair of fives and once 5-5-5. They expressed real chagrin holding those fives and the lead. Of course you can't tell them how smart you are to have played that hand so that you could ditch that lone five and score 31-2 that way. You've got to say with all modesty something like: "Even a blind sow finds an acorn once in a while!" "Just blind luck!" "Stumbled into a pile of s--t and come out smelling like a rose, huh?" Am sure there are other classic lines out there to offer after taking that 31-2. Get them down pat and you'll make friends even when they are experiencing adversity.
Inushtuk1 says: : - ). Perhaps your opponents should have led a 5 instead of an X- card; especially the one with 5-5-5?
Ras2829 says: Hi Inustuk1: Good observation! One popular book on cribbage states that "only an idiot would lead a five!" For that and other reasons many players are reluctant to lead a five any place in the pegging play. Of course, you must know that I have been an idiot for years. I lead the five most of the time if playing a defensive or optimal strategy. I do not lead a five from 4-5-5-6 as Cribbage Prof does. Have often scored well with my fives from this hand leading the four and drawing a 10-spot in response. Then drop the five for count of 19 and you can see how that goes if dealer pairs my five. Always lead it from 5-5-5-X, sometimes from 5-5-X-X, and frequently from 4-4-5-6 or 4-5-6-6.
Inushtuk1 says: Just pray opponent does not pair that 4 lead from 4-5-5-6 I guess.
Inushtuk1 says: From 4-5-6-6 I think you meant you usuall lead the 6 right?
Ras2829 says: Hi Inustuk1: Sorry for the confusion. Certainly lead from the sixes when the double is at the top of the hand. That would be true whether playing offense or defense.
cribbage in the counties
122 votes

Joined: April 2016

 
 
 
Sunday 5:00 PM
I can't believe so many people tossed 5-5