October 12, 2021
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Total votes: 220 |
james500 3924 votes Joined: June 2013 |
    Tuesday 3:14 AM
I think it's worth holding two points fewer in hand in order to discard 5_5 rather than 4_5c. |
mrob2199 1436 votes Joined: February 2009 |
    Tuesday 3:17 AM
Tough call on this one but I’m going to go for the big 6 cut here-and it’s always a possibility we can peg 9 points with our fives if dealer has pictures with a 5-or 6 if he just has pictures-so those aspects must be included in our decision making here Eolus619 says: Rob…I think JQT refers to pegging as the “soul” of the game. At times , I view this part of the game as an inconvenient aspect of the rules. However, I do very much appreciate you sharing your keen insight into it. The good news for me is …there are only four cards involved. cribbagepogo says: Um, you are the dealer, if I read correctly. |
JQT 4143 votes Joined: October 2008 |
    Tuesday 3:24 AM
First Dealer, let's go, and let's mix it up! There's a Psychological Factor possibly at play here if we can bring ourselves to Toss (5 5), which has a Crib Value close to Nine Points, into our First Crib of the Game.
The PAIR of 5 Cards "Down Under" would ostensibly therefore start us off with around a Dozen Points 'static' hopefulness (and prior to the Cut Card), which is a fairly healthy baseline. Other ideas include the more prosaic-looking Toss (4 5) or Toss (8 9), the former of which I do like, and the latter of which I at least find very intriguing. I'm initially drawn like a moth to the Toss (5 5) flame, that irrepressible, indefatigable beacon, or "light at the end of the tunnel" of Our Crib; and if we do go there, we would just have to hope that it's not the proverbial train coming the other way (which I guess might be the risk of a Two-Point Crib), or that the warm glow of its distant but inviting light is maybe after all just a Flickering Flame of Dismal Deceit and Death! But nevertheless; some will risk it! And so: do we Toss (5 5) and Come-What-May? Or do we take on the more nuanced approach, and either Toss (4 5) or Toss (8 9) today? The Toss (8 9), as I intimated earlier, has quite a bit of intrigue and mystique surrounding it, and it would entail keeping our 4-5-5 "energy" all in one place. But I believe I shall find the "middle ground" discard of Toss (4 5) the best idea today, as it "spreads the '5 Card Love' around" like no other discard. After the 9 Card Cut, we have Ten Points in our Hand, and Lord-Knows-What in our Crib: but please let it be greater than just Two Points! |
dec 6359 votes Joined: April 2008 |
    Tuesday 3:49 AM
Potential for 16-14 in main hand my choice here. dec |
Rosemarie44 2052 votes Joined: March 2016 |
    Tuesday 3:57 AM
Prefer a suited 4-5 in my crib than 8-9 and I get to keep a 5 in my hand with this decision. What's not to like? |
glmccuskey 4102 votes Joined: April 2011 |
    Tuesday 4:57 AM
4-5 is a top ten discard. |
Eolus619 1343 votes Joined: June 2020 |
    Tuesday 5:15 AM
At some point in my cribbage journey , I may actually come to understand the big hand sacrifice rule & apply it properly. So here I go again. You can toss 5-5 and sacrifice four points if the remaining keep can cut to 12 points. Eolus619 says: No cut gets 4-8-9-10 to twelve. See what Ras has to say about all this. https://vashoncribbage.weebly.com/uploads/5/6/7/4/56741021/lesson2-1.pdf Eolus619 says: his explanation is at the bottom of the second page in the link above |
zeke76 1397 votes Joined: August 2018 |
    Tuesday 5:31 AM
I like double nickels in the crib, but this hand is above my paygrade so I’m interested in seeing what everyone says. |
Ras2829 5155 votes Joined: November 2008 |
    Tuesday 6:02 AM
Choosing defense all the way to include the pegging, discarding suited 4-5 has a very slight advantage(larger crib and slightly better peg avoidance). Would play off the lead although will always dump a lone 5 to score 15-2 if a X-pointer led. Play off small card leads though would play the four spot on a deuce lead. On mid card leads would play the 9 on a six lead, 10 spot on a 7 lead, and play the four on 8 or 9 lead. Eolus offers a very strong clue as to why 5-5 is not the way to go with this hand. Check out the link. If you have further questions, E-mails are always welcome at raswino29@outlook.com. Eolus619 says: Ras…is the reason the big hand rule doesn’t apply the fact that the keep doesn’t start with eight to begin with ?..or is this just one of the 5% that is the exception Ras2829 says: Hi Eolus619: Two questions that must be asked when applying the Big Hand Rule. First, did I stay within the sacrifice limits? If discarding 5-5, not allowed to give up more than four points in ahnd score. So in this case, the answer to first question is YES (could have held six and now have three). Second question is: Do I still have a hand fo 12 point potential or more? Answer is NO. If either question ends up with a NO, 5-5 is not the choice. That approach will work with 96% of all hands which include a 5-5 when dealing. Eolus619 says: thx Ras… Ras2829 says: Sorry about the pegging in my original post. Do not have a four spot; so can't play the four on a deuce lead. So would play the 5 on A-2-3-8-9-X pointer. On a five lead, score 15-2, get rid of that 10 spot, if leading a five likely will pick off the ten with J-Q, etc. Score 2 pegs and be rid of it. Eolus619 says: thx Ras…your pegging insight is always helpful and appreciated .. |
Gougie00 5731 votes Joined: March 2008 |
    Tuesday 6:02 AM
I like that 455 together. The 9 certainly is a clunker cut. Had I known that, I would have tossed 55 in my crib.
Until we put the clocks back, its still dark at 7 am. Ugh, its fall. |
mfetchCT425 1400 votes Joined: February 2009 |
    Tuesday 6:31 AM
Like the big hand potential here. If it was 3-5-5-8-9-10 or 2-5-5-8-9-10, or A-5-5-8-9-10, I would have tossed the 5-5. I think the hand is compromised too much today if we hold 4-8-9-10 which only has a max of 8. Pegging potential should be greater with this hold as well as Rob explains so well above. |
MiketheExpert 1123 votes Joined: April 2021 |
    Tuesday 6:52 AM
Close decision here....but not between the two discards you'd think. I was debating between the (4c 5c) and the (8d 9d). Don't get me wrong, tossing (5 5) is usually never a bad idea, and here I would be hard-pressed to call this the WRONG decision on first hand. However, I'm leaving myself with only a maximum potential score of 8 in the hand (which I would have gotten on today's cut), and as great as (5 5) is, it still only leaves you with a guaranteed 2 pts in the crib.
It is easiest to see the fallacy behind this when you look at the potential of (4 5 5 10), which STARTS with 6 pts and has potential to INCREASE to 16 pts...Then, the (5 5) idea looks rather poor in comparison. But what about starting with only 1 less pt (5 8 9 10) and tossing the excellent (4c 5c) in comparison to this?...As I stated, I think it is actually a very close decision, and I can't fault for choosing either one in this scenario...The difference in crib toss value between the (4 5) and (8 9) and SLIGHTLY better defensive pegging prospects of (5 8 9 10) just tipped the scales in favour of the (4 5) toss for me...Good way to dump the lone five is by scoring 15 on any face card lead here..Nice lucky double-run cut with the 9, and now we're off to the races...! |
Jazzselke 2587 votes Joined: March 2009 |
    Tuesday 7:08 AM
4 cards do not help the 45510- 2,7,8 9. However, 3 of those cards would help the 89 toss. With the potential of the 45510 hand, I like that added aspect of the hand/crib configuration. The 45 discard would be my close second choice. Eolus619 says: yes indeed…crib is an extension of the dealer’s hand..good reminder to us all |
Fender Bass 373 votes Joined: July 2021 |
    Tuesday 7:14 AM
In for a penny in for a pound. Let's throw both 5's and hope our opponent throws some X's in our crib. Also, keeping the double run possible. |
SallyAnn3 908 votes Joined: March 2020 |
    Tuesday 7:27 AM
I went with RAS' big hand rule, and Gary's logic. |
wasa 3019 votes Joined: November 2014 |
    Tuesday 8:10 AM
#1 toss of 5-5 to my crib. Cut helps my hand but not sure about the crib. First dealer in theory is defence so only take safe pegging points. wasa says: Yes, I know of RAS big hand rule, but I'm ignoring it today just because. |
fentesk 1204 votes Joined: January 2021 |
    Tuesday 10:20 AM
I came down to the 4-5 or 8-9. I know 5-5 is a crib superstar, but it looks like here I'm better spreading the 5 wealth around. If it were a smaller run (A-2-3), or a run containing a 15 (7-8-9) I might have gone 5-5, but 8-9-10 doesn't wow me.
The choice of 4-5 over 8-9 came down to wanting guaranteed points from hand and crib. I'm dealing first and playing defense and don't want to strike out in the crib at the same time I'm bypassing pegging points. I checked my calculated values after selecting, it looks like 8-9 score 2 or fewer ~35% of the time in own crib compared to 7.6% for 4-5 (which aren't terribly far off from values Ras has shared in his course notes.) I'll take the 9 cut and defensively peg. Ras2829 says: Hi fentesk: Your figures for 8-9 at 0-2 points are very close to my course notes of 33.6% and 4-5 never scores zero though does score two points 6.386%. More than five times the number of cribs of 0-2 with 8-9 discard. That's the major reason that 4-5 is 8/91 and 8-9 is 31/91. That 4-5 works with all those highly favored 6-X discards and does well with A-X or 3-X as well. fentesk says: Ras, I remain in awe of your ability to track all the hands you did. I tried tracking against a computer opponent and couldn't keep it up for much more than a game, to do so over the board and make competitive decisions must have been something to see! |